The Guardian and Comments - April 2016

adding here my thread:
http://jothut.com/cgi-bin/junco.pl/replies/68594

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"In case you're new to the internet:"articles written by women attract more abuse/trolling than those written by men"" https://twitter.com/astrokatie/status/719852228320694272 - #media #comments - what's funny is that the media people who oppose comments on news sites also love twitter. #moronism
From: JR's : micro blog - Apr 12, 2016 - reply

16 replies
JR: women writers feel abuse from the trolls on twitter too. some media orgs ended their comments on their news sites because they believe that the real discussions occur on those great spaces of social media civility, such as twitter and facebook.
- 2 hrs ago - # - reply

JR: media person's tweet https://twitter.com/karenkho/status/719852876416344064 - "@mathewi I know you love and defend comments, but this really shows why they're horrible for women and POC." --- yet she uses twitter to broadcast her claim.
- 2 hrs ago - # - reply

JR: comments on media sites are not the problem. how the media orgs manage their comment systems is the problem. in my opinion, it's easier to create civil discussions on your own site than on social media. more barriers to entry are needed. it's not impossible. imagination is required.
- 2 hrs ago - # - reply

JR: http://www.niemanlab.org/2016/04/the-guardians-web-we-want-series-will-analyze-abuse-on-the-papers-own-site/
- 2 hrs ago - # - reply

JR: http://www.theguardian.com/media/2016/apr/08/the-guardian-wants-to-engage-with-readers-but-how-we-do-it-needs-to-evolve
- 2 hrs ago - # - reply

JR: http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/apr/11/the-guardian-view-on-online-abuse-building-the-web-we-want
- 2 hrs ago - # - reply

JR: http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/apr/12/the-dark-side-of-guardian-comments
- 2 hrs ago - # - reply

JR: http://mediagazer.com/160412/p7#a160412p7
- 2 hrs ago - # - reply

JR: "The Guardian, which receives more than 50,000 reader comments a day ..." - yowzer! i had no idea that the site received that money comments. the solutions for giant sites like The Guardian, NY Times, and WaPo will differ greatly from what might work for mid-sized metro daily like The Toledo Blade.
- 1 hr ago - # - reply

JR: quoting from the guardian stories now ...
- 7 mins ago - # - reply

JR: "The internet has a problem, and that problem is people." ---- Conversely, the internet offers a lot of good, and that good is people. Or better, replace "internet" with "world". The world has a problem, and that problem is people. The world has a lot of good, and that good is people.
- 6 mins ago - # - reply

JR: "Dramatic incidents of public harassment, abuse and threatening behaviour are never far from the news ..." -- that's not restricted to the internet only. violent behavior has existed in the world for thousands of years.
- 4 mins ago - # - reply

JR: "There is a widespread perception that these are problems that need to be solved, and many digital media sites - including Twitter, Facebook and many others - are actively looking for solutions." ----
- 4 mins ago - # - reply

JR: interesting. a lot of uncivil discussions occur on or via twitter and facebook, and yet some people are looking to those orgs for solutions. many media orgs failed to be innovative on how to manage comments with their custom solutions, therefore those orgs outsourced their discussions to Facebook.
- 2 mins ago - # - reply

JR: trading one cesspool for another is not a solution. custom solutions can work, in my opinion, if barriers are erected that deter the trolls and spammers. the users who want to create a true community won't mind the barriers. the media org must give such a system one to two years to grow.
- 57 secs ago - # - reply

JR: "For news organisations, the question is no longer whether or not we want to engage with our audience: no news organisation that wants to be relevant in the digital age would dream of retreating from social media, and engagement in many forms is vital to our survival."
- 0 secs ago - # - reply

In some places, news organisations are stepping away from comments, deciding that the costs outweigh the benefits, and turning to other modes of interaction instead - often away from their own platforms, in striking contrast to other industries which are eager to invite interaction that they can manage and own.

The Guardian is not making that retreat - but that means we do have to evolve and manage our comments deliberately. We are not like the 4chan message boards, where anyone can say almost anything without consequences. Just as Facebook, Twitter, Metafilter and many others provide spaces for different kinds of communities to gather, we want to create spaces on the Guardian for particular conversations and particular groups to speak - with each other and with us.

Glad that MetaFilter was mentioned. Too often when the topic of comments or user-contributed content is discussed, MetaFilter's barriers are not mentioned.

The issue of comments on news sites is often conflated with conversations about free speech - about the ability of individuals to speak their minds without fear of government censorship.

I've heard that argument often at Toledo Talk. Users have accused me of censorship and prohibiting free speech. But even 4chan has removed postings that violate the site's guidelines. Free speech does not exist at Toledo Talk nor at any of these other sites. Users have the freedom to start their own websites, and they can manage their sites anyway they want.